Easiturn 3 controller questions

[rickturner646]

I have just acquired an Easiturn 3 lathe which – despite the fact that it must be the best part of 30 years old – is almost brand new. It’s got no visible wear and not even any scratches on the paint. It came out of a college where it clearly had little use, and as it’s obviously had a good life so far, I’d like to continue that.

I have the machine powered up and running and can make the various parts move predictably, which is a good start. However, I have several questions that I am trying to find an answer to, so thought that I would ask here first.

I want to get the RS232 (serial) link running so that I can download programmes from a PC (sure beats typing – if only for error prevention!). I have read the various forum entries and understand that I need to make up a cable for pins 2,3,7 (at the PC) end. I can do this no problem – and figure out whether or not it needs crossing over – but before I can get that far, I have a couple of questions:

• - The serial socket at the lathe end is something odd. It is a circular one the size of a DIN plug but has a different pin configuration to standard 6-pin DIN, which consequently won’t fit. Anybody know what type of socket this is, so that I can try and order up a matching plug?
  - Can the lathe be driven directly by the PC, and if so, what software is needed at the PC end to do this?
  - How do I start the ‘data link’ programme on the controller? And when I get it running, how do I send a g-code programme to the machine - or is it really as simple as the obvious old command line trick of ‘COPY p0001.nc COM1’.... be nice if so, but in this case, how does the lathe handle CR-LF and EOF characters? Does it need or expect a particular format??
  - How do I find out what version of PCNC the machine is running?

More generally, I have a couple of other questions:

• - When I run the lathe in manual mode and get an error message on the green screen – for example ‘X axis limits exceeded’ – how do I clear this? Hitting ‘reset’ or ‘enter’ etc don’t do anything and at the moment, the only way I can find to clear the message is to power off the control unit.
  - If I press one of the spindle buttons in manual mode, it asks me to enter an RPM between 100 and 150. Spindle starts ok but I cant get it to go above 200 rpm or below 100 using the + and – keys. The manual says ‘programmable 0-2000 rpm’, so what am I doing wrong? In case it matters, this lathe has a nice big air-powered chuck on it, not a conventional manual one.
  - The machine has the I/Ps and AUX ports mentioned in another append on this forum, but they’re not in the manual. Any idea what they are for? The machine does not have an autochanger, and as far as I can see, has never been fitted with one.
  - It does however have an extra box about 12 by 9 by 5 inches in size bolted to the outside of the casing at the spindle end. This contains a 25v power supply and what look like relays or chunky contactors – three of them. Curiously, this box also has on the outside a pair of D-shell connectors the same size as said AUX and IPS ports, but I have neither information nor cables. Any ideas what it was for? My best guess is ‘bar feeder’ but there is no sign of one being fitted. It’s possible that it was for an autochanger – three power feeds presumably corresponding to ‘revolve forward, ‘revolve reverse’, and ‘lock’ – but the electrics seem a bit over-the-top for such a mundane application. They look serious enough to switch a small electrical power station on and off with. Any ideas?

If I can’t get the machine to work as-is, a full Mach rebuild is going to happen to the electronics, but as it seems in perfect working order I thought that I’d try the original system first. No point in making work or in ruining something that’s just fine.

Many thanks in advance, and best regards,

Rick Turner

[Denford Admin]

I've added some more manuals to the top of this section which may help

[rickturner646]

Thx....

I'll go away and do some reading....

Rick

[Denford Admin]

This other post may also help - try contact SimonRafferty to see if he eventually got drip feed to work on the Easiturn:
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1697&hilit=din

[rickturner646]

Thx.

I've managed to find a plug that fits the serial socket (now I know why I have kept that box of 25 year old computer parts) and can get the controller into MDI mode (hey, 4k of memory and 4800 baud!)

I now suspect however that there is a problem with one of the keypads - it tells me to press <RESET> to get out of datalink mode but when I do, nothing happens (would also explain why pressing reset does not clear the error messages I get in manual mode). Also, the 'S' key is not active, so I cant try and programme (spindle) speed to see if I can get it above the 200rpm it will accept in M03 mode. I need to look into this, but any suggestions welcomed. My first suspicion would be a loose connection somewhere.

From the parts list/manuals that you uploaded earlier (thanks!) I now believe that the external box with the PSU and relays is the controller for an autochanger - though why was is fitted to a lathe without the turret is a mystery - and that this box communicates with the AUX and IPS sockets.

I'm making some progress, and will try and get further tonight.

Thanks for the help!

Rick

[Martin]

If the door interlocks are not made then this inhibits the spindle speed.
You should be able to see if the door is open in the T test mode.
Just press T when first powered up which allows you to see the state of the guards switch. Also check that the door is aligned correctly with the sensors.

[rickturner646]

Looks like my keyboard PCB at least is dead - the RESET switch was indeed broken so I swapped it out for one of the unused (and working) switches. I got the lathe up and running then put it into data link mode, hit (the new) RESET to get out, and the electronics crashed. Power off reset, drive the slide manually overlimit to get an error message, hit RESET, and the control unit crashed again.

Tried the T key as suggested to get into test mode but there is no result, and I still am unable to enter spindle speed through the S key. However, both switches work physically work - I tried them with a multimeter and they also show up on the keyboard test.

Oh well, looks like a Mach retrofit after all. I think that I will try and retain the existing inverter and drive boards if possible, but I need to start looking into this.

Rick

[rickturner646]

Given that I need to make a conversion, I'd like to ask if any specs and drawings still exist, and if so, if I can get hold of them from you:

• - Specs etc for the stepper motors and main (spindle) motor - voltages, current, pinouts, etc
  - Specs and schematics for the drive boards
  - Specs and schematics for the inverter board
  - Connection information and schematics for the foot-pedal and electrical valves for the (Pratt Burnerd) air-operated chuck

Thanks in advance,

Rick

[rickturner646]

and of course, I forgot one:

• - specs and connection info for the shaft encoder on the main spindle

Must be a friday night!

Rick

[djc]

...of course, I forgot one:

• - specs and connection info for the shaft encoder on the main spindle

Have you considered downloading and thoroughly reading the documents that the site admin. spends a lot a time and trouble posting?

Answers to your questions are within; seek, young Jedi, and with Google's help, ye shall find.

Have you pulled some sheet metal off the machine and looked at the things about which you ask? I am not aware of a 'spindle encoder' on an Easiturn, only a slotted disk with a photo-interrupter switch (that has an RS part number on it). A small bit of time and effort on your part will locate the datasheet and the PCB is small enough and simple enough for you to draw out the circuit yourself.

Once you have read the literature and done the groundwork, ask specific questions referenced to this literature rather than 'tell me everything I need to know' vagueness.

[rickturner646]

Hmm, tetchy. Be useful if you understood what the issue is before sounding off unnecessarily.

At this moment, all the covers etc are off the machine and the electronics module is dismantled and laid out on a table. And I still have to ask questions, because:

• - the docs that admin has indeed so kindly uploaded only contain level 1 information - in other words, they're block diagram schematics. That's fine for figuring out connectors and ports and which wire goes where, but completely useless in terms of figuring out e.g. what is the voltage or current on port xx to motor xx. That information needs the spec sheet and cant be deduced from the fact that the wires happen to be black, white, red, and yellow.
  - Some of the parts where I have asked for info dont have identifying marks that can be used to get spec sheets (the stepper motors, for example). Yep, I can simply rip them out and replace them with NEMA 34 motors, but since they seem to be good, I'd rather reuse them which means that I need to understand their rating - voltage and amperage. Pinouts I already have. The parts list that was kindly uploaded simply lists these as 'X axis stepper motor, qty 1' and gives a part number, not specs.
  - One part - the air-chuck - is not mentioned in any of the documentation, except on the brochures as an 'optional accessory'. There are no drawings or schematics of any kind online (anywhere) that I can find, so asking for one is sensible. If it does not exist, I'll reverse engineer the hardware.
  - The remainder of the parts are boards with multiple components and were manufactured specifically for Denford, for this type of lathe. So, there is no information on Google or anywhere else that I can find - perhaps unsurprising - so asking Denford if they have it is the logical first step. Here too I can always rip out the driver boards and inverter and replace them with microstep drivers and a Westinghouse/Teco inverter, but since the existing ones seem to work fine it's more sensible to try and reuse them first.
  - Finally, this lathe does have an encoder fitted to the spindle, not a disk/opto combination. If no info exists for this I can probably reverse engineer it, if not I'll replace it.

So, now you know why I have asked for this info - which undoubtedly still exists in many cases. If I were to take the easy route - ripping out all the existing parts and replacing them with 'modern' ones - I'd not need to ask questions. However, the lathe etc is really well designed and incredibly well built, so I'd like to preserve as much as possible.

I've rebuilt a couple of old machines before now, both mechanically and electronically, so am quite at home doing so.

Rick

[djc]

- Some of the parts where I have asked for info don't have identifying marks that can be used to get spec sheets (the stepper motors, for example).... The parts list that was kindly uploaded simply lists these as 'X axis stepper motor, qty 1' and gives a part number, not specs.

On this point, I respectfully request you read the parts list a little closer.

In the "Easiturn-brochure-and-illustrated-parts-manual-OCR.pdf" on pages 18 & 19, it describes the stepping motors as "Cetronics HY200". Type that phrase into Google, and what is the third result that pops up? A link to this very forum

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=3032

There's also a Combivert manual in the same sub-section of the forum.

Have you looked in the 'Electronics' section as there was someone there who knew the controls intimitely, and offered a commercial repair service?

There is an awful lot of info. about; it's just not collated and indexed. The Easimill also had a PNC control, so that's an avenue that's also worth pursuing. Using Google with the site:www.denforddata.com qualifier will also assist in your search.

[rickturner646]

Thanks for the info - I'll go back and re-check the docs that I have and see if I can find the info there.

Rick

[Denford Admin]

There is an awful lot of info. about; it's just not collated and indexed.

Unfortunately that's very true and it's becoming more of an issue. At least I vaguely remember there having been some info about something on here, but it still takes me a few attempts to find it.
I'll have a look for an improved search add-in for the forum, or maybe add a google search button